Joe Wurzelbacher, McCain versus Obama debate Options

[Jim]

Just who is this plumber guy?

Wonder why the McCain camp picked him

[Rhoda]

Oh, for goodness sakes and tiny kittens!

One of Obama's 'advisors' sent him out among the common folk, such as I am, and Obama ended up in this guy's neighborhood. The guy took the time to ask a question which is of interest to many, and Obama incautiously answered it honestly.

Now, of course, the media, ignoring the question and the answer, is 'vetting' this man like crazy, (while ignoring Ayers and Rezko et al).

I believe Mc Cain is a clever man, but clever enough to set up this meeting in the plumber's own neighborhood?

Now that is quite a conspiracy theory!

[Rhoda]

This strikes me as a correct summation of the event.

Lesson learned: Do not question Obama ever on anything. Not a hopeful thought for an Obama Presidency.

And now you know why no one else asks Obama any hard questions about his plans.

<H2 class=date-header>Friday, October 17, 2008</H2><H3 class=post-title><A href="http://lawhawk.blogspot.com/2008/10/left-joe-must-go.html">The Left: Joe Must Go </H3>It began not long after the video surfaced showing Joe Wurzelbacher question Sen. Barack Obama on his tax and spend schemes to which Obama responded that he wanted to share and spread the wealth - clear indications of his socialist intentions.



The media and the leftists online began a concerted attempt to try and destroy the man who outed Obama on the most important issue of the day - economics.

Now, the story isn't about Obama's socialism, but whether Joe is a licensed plumber, whether he's paid his taxes, say that it's not his real name (he's going by his middle name), question whether he's registered to vote (he is), and it all points to how anyone can dare question Obama's intentions or expose that he's a socialist in word and deed.

Joe is now being vetted by the media in ways that they haven't done to Obama or his staffers.

After all, how is it that one of Obama's staffers has tax liens in multiple states? The media isn't nearly as curious as to Obama's ties to Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, despite calling on Raines and Johnson - and Johnson was on his VP search selection committee.

As I noted immediately after the video surfaced, a plumber shall lead the charge against Obama's socialism, and now Obama's friends in the media and online are doing all they can to destroy the person who revealed Obama's intentions.

Leftist loons are publishing Joe's address online - all in the name of what? They want to destroy this man's life. It's an explicit display of the left's intolerance and thuggish behavior, which has been present all along, but has found new life because of the manner and timing in which Joe exposed Obama for who he is and what he stands for.

This strategy will absolutely backfire on Obama and the left. The stifling of dissent, of mere questioning Obama on his policies, is not going to resonate with most Americans. They will see it as bullying and intimidation to get people to avoid asking tough questions of their elected leaders and prospective politicians. Most Americans actually relate to Joe, which makes the attacks on him appear as attacks on all hard-working Americans.

To riff on a theme that Instapundit is often fond of saying: they said that when Bush was elected, those who question politician's motives would be crushed - and they were right - only that it is the media and left that is trying to crush those who have the audacity to ask pointed questions of elected leaders and those who wish to be President of the US.

Ed Morrissey notes that there is a stench of desperation to all this. He is right; the left knows that people in this country have a serious distrust of socialism and redistribution of their hard earned wealth. Obama has tried to hide his intentions and a compliant media that does not question his policies aids and abets Obama in seeking the office of the Presidency. How is it that no one in the media could ask the question that Joe did, along with the follow up that resulted when Obama revealed that he was intent upon spreading the wealth - code for socialism?

Others weighing in on the media's actions and the left's insistence that Joe must be destroyed: The Anchoress, Jammie, and Sister Toldjah

[Jim]

Interesting story Rhoda. thanks for that!

Frankly, I dont mind socialism in moderation. True democracy will trend towards socialist ideals as it tends to level playing field economically. Most people are under middle class and would benefit from some amount of economic socialism rather than unbridalled out of control capitalism, which only benefits the wealthy.

Also, I hardly think that this wil backfire on Obama. It would take much more than this to harm Obama's lead or even effect it.

[Rhoda]

I agree with your last statement. I will repeat that this did NOT take place at a rally. Obama was in this guy's neighborhood.

I think the attacks on this man are shameful.

As for socialism, we have gone quite a ways down that road already. I think many of us look to the countries who have gone around the bend in that road and do not want to follow.

In any case, here is the entire conversation for which the Plumber is being savaged, outed, lampooned, and ridiculed.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vFC9jv9jfoA

[Rhoda]

By the way, the backlash on the way this man is being treated is tremendous.

Here's a new one.

Here we have a man IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD who now must be disfigured and ruined because he committed the most heinous of sins. He disagreed with the One. To his face. On TV. And it hit the target. He exposed the lie of the common man not possibly being other than a supporter, and laid naked the reality of Obama's attitude about tax, the govt, and the people. But never mind, the organization which seeks to criminalize criticism, silence opposition, and intimidate thorough analysis now, machine like, acquires Joe. Samuel J.Wurzelbacher. And the message sent is quite clear...'if any of you pop your heads up, and really want to speak up in Obama's America...this is what it's going to be like'. The HYPOCRISY of these people is breathtaking.

He is not a politician
He is not a smear merchant
He is not a spin expert
He does not make speeches
He is not even a blogger

He is a private guy with struggles JUST LIKE US.

JUST LIKE US.

And this man JUST LIKE US is being attacked just as if he were Sarah Palin right now, because HE SPOKE UP IN AMERICA.

So we have his union trying to ruin him with the information he has not passed their license test. No doubt he will face dismemberment from the plumber's board for using a wrench without a license to practice. We have his tax issues, PERSONAL tax issues exposed, and gee doesn't that just make him EVEN MORE JUST LIKE US.

I was assaulted last night by commercials from Obama all telling me how CONCERNED he was going to be with my problems for the next four years.

Change? You bet. Worse than any democrat's nightmare of Karl Rove is the democratic naitonal leadership and their attitude of entitlement and self righteous views of what govt should be. And their attitude of what opposition should receive.
Even for men and women JUST LIKE US.

Bushitler? Is it that they cannot help but credit (by hyperbole one assumes) their enemies with what they know THEY would do?

I still can't believe the lengths.

These people are going to cause a backlash of incredible proportions

UPDATE
The Obama campaign has twin denials for this behavior vs Joe...
1) It's not us, nor is the media carrying water for us
2) It's McCain's fault for emphasizing what Joe had to say

Can you believe this?

[Rhoda]

Uhoh. They've got him now! Turns out Joe once lived in Alaska!

[Jim]

Uhoh. They've got him now! Turns out Joe once lived in Alaska!

LOL!

This is turning into a frenzy!

[Rhoda]

Here is a detailed revelation of the plot!

The Evil That Is Joe the Plumber
John Podhoretz - 10.17.2008 - 12:57 PM The plot could not be more nefarious. In 2008, Barack Obama decides to go ring doorbells in Toledo, Ohio. A decade earlier, anticipating just such an event, the notorious S&L swindler Charles Keating instructs his son-in-law to move his son-in-law’s cousin, a man named Samuel, into the path of Barack Obama’s eventual walking tour. He further instructs Samuel to a) pretend he is a plumber even though he doesn’t have a license and to call himself “Joe” rather than “Sam,” since “Joe the Plumber” sounds better in a nationally televised debate than “Sam the Plumber.” Then, when Obama shows up, Sam aka Joe is to ask Obama about Obama’s tax plan, and focus his eyes on Obama, thereby telepathically forcing the Illinois Senator to say he wants to “spread the wealth around.”

Surely this must be the true story. Otherwise, why would seemingly honorable people in the media, in the Left blogosphere, and a would-be vice president decide to investigate the bona fides of Joe the Plumber in a transparent effort to destroy the credibility, job prospects, and good name of a hard-working single father – when all he did, it would appear to the naked eye, was to live in a house on a block where Barack Obama decided to come calling in pursuit of a nice TV spot on the local news?

[Jim]

Well, regardless of what the actual story is, I have worked in politics and set up events similar.

Obama's (or McCains) security detail and campaign would not let anyone within a city block of him that is not pre-approved and would not allow anyone in direct contact with him (face to face meeting) without orchestrating the event from start to finish. Its just PR.

[Kayak]

Joe the Plumber is McCain's imaginary friend!

http://www.nbc.com/Saturday_Night_Live/vid...-debate/768721/

[Honu]

Obama's (or McCains) security detail and campaign would not let anyone within a city block of him that is not pre-approved and would not allow anyone in direct contact with him (face to face meeting) without orchestrating the event from start to finish. Its just PR.

Absolute nonsense. Other than "pre-approved" people come into direct contact with Presidential candidates all the time. It is absolutely untrue that the security detail vets everyone "within a city block" or who may come in direct contact with candidates. Chance encounters with ordinary people happen all the time when candidates get out to "press the flesh". Much as some campaign staffers may try and orchestrate everything, this incident just shows that it is virtually impossible unless, of course, you are suggesting that Obama set up this meeting with Joe.

[Jim]

Absolute nonsense. Other than "pre-approved" people come into direct contact with Presidential candidates all the time. It is absolutely untrue that the security detail vets everyone "within a city block" or who may come in direct contact with candidates. Chance encounters with ordinary people happen all the time when candidates get out to "press the flesh". Much as some campaign staffers may try and orchestrate everything, this incident just shows that it is virtually impossible unless, of course, you are suggesting that Obama set up this meeting with Joe.

Honu, you have no clue what your talking about. I've worked political campaigns, local, state and federal. I know how these things are put together. They leave VERY little to chance.

Its suicide to leave much to chance, not just politically. The security detail surrounding these candidates is tremendous and with a Presidentialrace, you probably have Secret service assisting.

[Honu]

Jim, I have been a part of Secret Service and State Department security details which protected the President, former Presidents, Presidential candidates, foreign heads of state and foreign dignitaries. I know exactly how it works. Obama's security detail doesn't have the Secret Service "assisting", his security detail IS the Secret Service.

Things are not just "left to chance" but neither are they so closely choreographed as you have described. The fact that Obama was blindsided by JTP and embarrassingly revealed his true intention to "spread the wealth" is a demonstration of that. Unless, of course, you think the Obama campaign set the whole thing up.

[Jim]

Jim, I have been a part of Secret Service and State Department security details which protected the President, former Presidents, Presidential candidates, foreign heads of state and foreign dignitaries. I know exactly how it works. Obama's security detail doesn't have the Secret Service "assisting", his security detail IS the Secret Service.

Things are not just "left to chance" but neither are they so closely choreographed as you have described. The fact that Obama was blindsided by JTP and embarrassingly revealed his true intention to "spread the wealth" is a demonstration of that. Unless, of course, you think the Obama campaign set the whole thing up.

Honu.

Ive worked campaigns and been part of it.

We are not talking a sitting President. We are talking running Campaigns... SS assists the security details, unless it is a sitting Pres then they control it. Also, VERY little is left to chance as these folks want to control bad PR. You'd be hard pressed to get a Federal cadidate that doesnt already know who he will meet and what they will talk about before they actually meet Its mostly scripted as I said.

BTW... much better answer than "non-sense". Much more interesting a post. Its good hearing your experiences and views.



lastly.. I feel sorry for Joe. Look at this:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ynews/ynews_pl97

[Honu]

SS assists the security details, unless it is a sitting Pres then they control it.

Jim, this simply isn't true. Once the candidate accepts SS protection, the SS is in charge.

I'll address the issue for the third time- if the campaign so closely controls who gets to meet the candidate and what they will talk about, does this mean that Obama's campaign set up the interaction with JTP?

[Haq al lugi]

True democracy will trend towards socialist ideals as it tends to level playing field economically. Most people are under middle class and would benefit from some amount of economic socialism rather than unbridalled out of control capitalism, which only benefits the wealthy.

Patently untrue. MOst people are in the middle of the middle class.

What benefits most people is for government to get out of the way and stop trying to micro-manage their behavior.

[Haq al lugi]

Well, regardless of what the actual story is, I have worked in politics and set up events similar.

Obama's (or McCains) security detail and campaign would not let anyone within a city block of him that is not pre-approved and would not allow anyone in direct contact with him (face to face meeting) without orchestrating the event from start to finish. Its just PR.

I have attended numerous events of the kind described above. I have never been vetted nor pre-approved. I have shaken hands with 2 governors of Texas, and one future president of the United States (twice). McCain, early in the primary season, traveled alone on commercial planes and carried his own luggage.

[Haq al lugi]

Honu, you have no clue what your talking about. I've worked political campaigns, local, state and federal. I know how these things are put together. They leave VERY little to chance.

Its suicide to leave much to chance, not just politically. The security detail surrounding these candidates is tremendous and with a Presidentialrace, you probably have Secret service assisting.

Your level of BS is amazing, Jim. In 2000, Bush got out of his limo in the inaugural parade, and waved and shook hands on his way to the Capitol. I stood on Pennsylvania Avenue in an adoring crowd as he and Laura walked by.

[Haq al lugi]

Honu.

Ive worked campaigns and been part of it.

I don't not believe this is accurate. I will stop short of calling it a lie. Maybe you can pass this load in a forum of cretins, but I know better. I have been a part of campaigns also. What you describe would be ridiculous for any serious candidate. Candidates must not seem aloof. To the contrary, they must seem real, and they get out among their constituents.

You describe an election of Saddam, not an American.

Who was this candidate whose campaigns you worked in? Give me a name.